Date   

Re: Pinterest and B&O research

Jim Mischke
 



Everybody,


Thank you all for your feedback.   It affirms my reservations, that it is a scam; nothing is free, even on the the internet; yet it can come in handy in a search.  It can unearth a scarce image or a counterintuitive source ( a B&O F3 image at University of North Texas archive ... who knew? )

I felt like a mouse, eager for the cheese, but what purpose is all this wood and metal structure around it?

I got what I needed.  Let's think about B&O and start some new threads.


Jim Mischke






On Sunday, October 24, 2021, 11:12:46 AM MDT, John Hagen via groups.io <sprinthag@...> wrote:


All.

A little tidbit here.

Back in 2005, I took some photos of a City of Milwaukee 1980 era FWD wrecker. I found it at their shops parked behind the garage. I saw it when delivering some parts and asked permission to photograph it.

The photos were posted on the old “Hanks Truck Pictures” site, which was taken down several years ago.

I wanted to post them on the “FWD Fire Trucks” group on Facebook as they accept any FWD photos. I discovered I had lost the photos in a fatal hard drive crash a couple of years ago. For some reason, they were not added to my Cloud site.

I started to search the web for them and found one shot on Pinterest posted by a guy from Demark! (It’s the ¾ view)

I did post it on the FWD group and later found some thumb drives I had forgotten about, one of which contained the photos.

While I do not use like Pinterest directly, occasionally I do get links to them from a search. I am not a member (anymore, tried it once was overwhelmed by it and did manage, with a concerted effort, to end my membership). I don’t like what they do but I do occasionally find photos I can’t find elsewhere.

John Hagen

 

From: main@BaltimoreAndOhioRailroadList.groups.io <main@BaltimoreAndOhioRailroadList.groups.io> On Behalf Of Ben Sullivan
Sent: Sunday, October 24, 2021 9:46 AM
To: main@BaltimoreAndOhioRailroadList.groups.io
Subject: Re: [BaltimoreAndOhioRailroadList] Pinterest and B&O research

 

Jim,

 

Think of Pinterest as a sleazy, middle-man leech, scraping money from the collective. Pinterest fancies itself all of the things you asked about; a search engine, social media, etc - and they make money through ads and data collection. They want you to log in so they can curate your interests and focus their advertising ray gun on you. Anyway, I am not a fan of Pinterest but as some folks have mentioned, they find things there that they "can't find anywhere else." Truth is, you can find those things elsewhere; you just haven't looked in the right place or entered the correct search terms yet. Pinterest is an aggregator. They scrape content from websites and social media posts and "host" it on their site. The users will often "pin" things, adding their own content preferences. As far as copyright, I don't think they claim ownership of anything - more of a display versus hosting. Like a gallery that allows users to build "collections" of things they like so they can see more of said things. Just do a search for "Baltimore Ohio Georgetown branch" and you'll basically find half of the photos from my website posted there on Pinterest, with hit-or-miss accreditation. (usually incorrect)



Those obscure photos that appear there are usually appearing there because they've been scraped and cataloged by someone or some bot. It is super helpful when you are searching for hard to find items, but usually frustrating because there is SO much chaff. 

 

Here's a simple pro tip. If you want to exclude Pinterest from your search results in Google, simply append your search term with "-site:pinterest.com" This will block any results from that domain. In the situation where you feel a look at Pinterest results could help, search normally without the suffix. 

There are two ways to approach this. 1) Continue doing what you're doing and maybe now and then blocking results from Pinterest by using the aforementioned suffix. Or, 2) embrace Pinterest. Register a login, set up your "likes" and start pinning things; topics you are interested in, etc. The more you pin, the more refined the results should become. Who knows - you may find that "white whale" you have been searching for. You can make an account using a throwaway email address and use bogus info if you're uncomfortable using real info. 

Happy hunting

Ben Sullivan
Brookeville, MD
http://sluggyjunx.com/rr/gb/


Re: Pinterest and B&O research

John Hagen
 

All.

A little tidbit here.

Back in 2005, I took some photos of a City of Milwaukee 1980 era FWD wrecker. I found it at their shops parked behind the garage. I saw it when delivering some parts and asked permission to photograph it.

The photos were posted on the old “Hanks Truck Pictures” site, which was taken down several years ago.

I wanted to post them on the “FWD Fire Trucks” group on Facebook as they accept any FWD photos. I discovered I had lost the photos in a fatal hard drive crash a couple of years ago. For some reason, they were not added to my Cloud site.

I started to search the web for them and found one shot on Pinterest posted by a guy from Demark! (It’s the ¾ view)

I did post it on the FWD group and later found some thumb drives I had forgotten about, one of which contained the photos.

While I do not use like Pinterest directly, occasionally I do get links to them from a search. I am not a member (anymore, tried it once was overwhelmed by it and did manage, with a concerted effort, to end my membership). I don’t like what they do but I do occasionally find photos I can’t find elsewhere.

John Hagen

 

From: main@BaltimoreAndOhioRailroadList.groups.io <main@BaltimoreAndOhioRailroadList.groups.io> On Behalf Of Ben Sullivan
Sent: Sunday, October 24, 2021 9:46 AM
To: main@BaltimoreAndOhioRailroadList.groups.io
Subject: Re: [BaltimoreAndOhioRailroadList] Pinterest and B&O research

 

Jim,

 

Think of Pinterest as a sleazy, middle-man leech, scraping money from the collective. Pinterest fancies itself all of the things you asked about; a search engine, social media, etc - and they make money through ads and data collection. They want you to log in so they can curate your interests and focus their advertising ray gun on you. Anyway, I am not a fan of Pinterest but as some folks have mentioned, they find things there that they "can't find anywhere else." Truth is, you can find those things elsewhere; you just haven't looked in the right place or entered the correct search terms yet. Pinterest is an aggregator. They scrape content from websites and social media posts and "host" it on their site. The users will often "pin" things, adding their own content preferences. As far as copyright, I don't think they claim ownership of anything - more of a display versus hosting. Like a gallery that allows users to build "collections" of things they like so they can see more of said things. Just do a search for "Baltimore Ohio Georgetown branch" and you'll basically find half of the photos from my website posted there on Pinterest, with hit-or-miss accreditation. (usually incorrect)



Those obscure photos that appear there are usually appearing there because they've been scraped and cataloged by someone or some bot. It is super helpful when you are searching for hard to find items, but usually frustrating because there is SO much chaff. 

 

Here's a simple pro tip. If you want to exclude Pinterest from your search results in Google, simply append your search term with "-site:pinterest.com" This will block any results from that domain. In the situation where you feel a look at Pinterest results could help, search normally without the suffix. 

There are two ways to approach this. 1) Continue doing what you're doing and maybe now and then blocking results from Pinterest by using the aforementioned suffix. Or, 2) embrace Pinterest. Register a login, set up your "likes" and start pinning things; topics you are interested in, etc. The more you pin, the more refined the results should become. Who knows - you may find that "white whale" you have been searching for. You can make an account using a throwaway email address and use bogus info if you're uncomfortable using real info. 

Happy hunting

Ben Sullivan
Brookeville, MD
http://sluggyjunx.com/rr/gb/


Re: Pinterest and B&O research

 

Jim,
 
Think of Pinterest as a sleazy, middle-man leech, scraping money from the collective. Pinterest fancies itself all of the things you asked about; a search engine, social media, etc - and they make money through ads and data collection. They want you to log in so they can curate your interests and focus their advertising ray gun on you. Anyway, I am not a fan of Pinterest but as some folks have mentioned, they find things there that they "can't find anywhere else." Truth is, you can find those things elsewhere; you just haven't looked in the right place or entered the correct search terms yet. Pinterest is an aggregator. They scrape content from websites and social media posts and "host" it on their site. The users will often "pin" things, adding their own content preferences. As far as copyright, I don't think they claim ownership of anything - more of a display versus hosting. Like a gallery that allows users to build "collections" of things they like so they can see more of said things. Just do a search for "Baltimore Ohio Georgetown branch" and you'll basically find half of the photos from my website posted there on Pinterest, with hit-or-miss accreditation. (usually incorrect)



Those obscure photos that appear there are usually appearing there because they've been scraped and cataloged by someone or some bot. It is super helpful when you are searching for hard to find items, but usually frustrating because there is SO much chaff. 
 
Here's a simple pro tip. If you want to exclude Pinterest from your search results in Google, simply append your search term with "-site:pinterest.com" This will block any results from that domain. In the situation where you feel a look at Pinterest results could help, search normally without the suffix. 

There are two ways to approach this. 1) Continue doing what you're doing and maybe now and then blocking results from Pinterest by using the aforementioned suffix. Or, 2) embrace Pinterest. Register a login, set up your "likes" and start pinning things; topics you are interested in, etc. The more you pin, the more refined the results should become. Who knows - you may find that "white whale" you have been searching for. You can make an account using a throwaway email address and use bogus info if you're uncomfortable using real info. 

Happy hunting

Ben Sullivan
Brookeville, MD
http://sluggyjunx.com/rr/gb/


Re: West Cumbo Yards

Mark Vitek
 

It should be in the Baltimore Division Roadway Maps volume IV - B&O Lines between Weverton, MD and Cumberland, MD.

There is still a West Cumbo Track Chart in the 1988 edition.

It appears to be available at the historical society's website (not sure of the edition though).


On Sun, Oct 24, 2021 at 8:29 AM Bob Morningstar via groups.io <bobmorningstar=protonmail.com@groups.io> wrote:
It's there a track chart available for west cumbo?



--
Mark Vitek / straypacket@... / N8MSV


Re: West Cumbo Yards

Bob Morningstar
 

It's there a track chart available for west cumbo?


Re: Pinterest and B&O research

Ken Briers
 

I second this emotion!

 

I’ve gone there before.  They try to entangle me into a relationship that suppresses others. 

 

Subsequently, I have stayed away.  I avoid anything that come up from it. 

 

Thanks!

Stay Safe!

Ken Briers

(202) 841-6851

 

From: main@BaltimoreAndOhioRailroadList.groups.io <main@BaltimoreAndOhioRailroadList.groups.io> On Behalf Of Thomas Evans via groups.io
Sent: Saturday, October 23, 2021 9:32 AM
To: main@BaltimoreAndOhioRailroadList.groups.io
Subject: Re: [BaltimoreAndOhioRailroadList] Pinterest and B&O research

 

Jim,

I am very leery of pinterest.
It seems to be a social media site masquerading as a search engine.
They obviously ignore copyright restrictions.
I have a friend who is an expert it IT, and he warned me away from it in no uncertain terms.
It gets bad reviews including that once you sign up they flood your email with unwanted messages, and it's impossible to unsubscribe.
I'd love to hear about the experiences of any members who have subscribed.

Good to know, however, that there is a link to the original site from which an image came that can be used without signing up.

Tom E.


Re: West Cumbo Yards

Bob Weston
 

Steve I’m sorry I can add nothing to your questions but I did visit W Tower after the yard was abandoned and was intrigued by the fact that access to the second floor was via a cast iron circular stairway located entirely inside the structure.
Bob Weston


Re: Pinterest and B&O research

Jim Mischke
 


I did google Pinterest in the middel of the night, the hits were irrelevant.    The Pinterest explanations were all about how to promote a business.   Pinning images there or exploring images for their own sake were scarcely mentioned.

I learn by hearing, and someone's direct experience is better than any wiki-thing.

I am also suspicious that recently in my B&O google searches that the Pinterest image apparently supplants the original source web sites I used to find, for the identical image.   Sounds like some collusion or a mastery of google prioritization.



On Saturday, October 23, 2021, 07:57:20 AM MDT, Eric Hansmann <eric@...> wrote:


Jim,

I think you do too much research in a sleep deprived state. You Google for B&O topics, but you don’t think to Google “What is Pinterest.” 

FWIW, I keep a small social media footprint. I am not a Pinterest user. 


Eric Hansmann
Murfreesboro, TN






John Kernan <jjkernan01@...>Unsubscribe
To:main@baltimoreandohiorailroadlist.groups.io
Sat, Oct 23 at 8:29 AM
Jim,
For starters, have you looked here for info.?:


I  had no idea about them either.

John Kernan


Re: Pinterest and B&O research

John Kernan
 

Jim,
For starters, have you looked here for info.?:


I  had no idea about them either.

John Kernan


Re: Pinterest and B&O research

Eric Hansmann
 

Jim,

I think you do too much research in a sleep deprived state. You Google for B&O topics, but you don’t think to Google “What is Pinterest.” 

FWIW, I keep a small social media footprint. I am not a Pinterest user. 


Eric Hansmann
Murfreesboro, TN


On Oct 23, 2021, at 3:38 AM, Jim Mischke <jmischke@...> wrote:


Googling around this evening, I found that most of my B&O image hits were on the web site Pinterest.    

I am a bit suspicious, because I have encountered most of these images before on web sites more closely associated with their originators, although that is debatable as well.  Another topic for another day.

Pinterest cites the web source and one can click on it to go there, yet there is no way all the originators gave any permissions for use on this site.

Is this a seach engine?  Is this a social media site?  Why do they insist I log in for a better experience?  How do they make money?  Ads and user data?

I am only curious now, because Pinterest has come to dominate my B&O google hits, not the host web sites with additional B&O image resources.   Flicker, Akron railroad club, Columbus Railroads, rrpicturearchives.net, Fallen Flags, etc.

Please educate me on the upsides and downsides of this site.










B&O content:

The opening photo is from the University of North Texas, and is miscaptioned as the Capitol Limited in 1959.   Wrong.   This B&O public relations photograph shows the lightweight Columbian, photographed when new in 1949.   Halethorpe is a credible guess at location.   Diesel is EMD F3A #87, built in 1947, and featured in a slew of 1949 B&O PR photos with this train.   B&O F3 A-B combinations probably powered the Columbian in its early years. 

I have emailed the Texas archive involved (not Pinterest) with these corrections, in hopes this will be corrected.   

A nitpicker's work is never done.  And it is harder than it looks.




Re: Pinterest and B&O research

Thomas Evans
 

Jim,

I am very leery of pinterest.
It seems to be a social media site masquerading as a search engine.
They obviously ignore copyright restrictions.
I have a friend who is an expert it IT, and he warned me away from it in no uncertain terms.
It gets bad reviews including that once you sign up they flood your email with unwanted messages, and it's impossible to unsubscribe.
I'd love to hear about the experiences of any members who have subscribed.

Good to know, however, that there is a link to the original site from which an image came that can be used without signing up.

Tom E.


Re: Pinterest and B&O research

Wade
 

Jim,

Believe it or not, I came across the FIRST AND ONLY photo of a Preston RR (a shipper of lumber/coal to the B&O) logging train I have ever seen.  I found that photo on Pinterest and examined it closely for accuracy of their locomotive #8 with other photos I have of #8, and in the photo, was also a photo of an American log loader at the rear of the train, though hard to see.  I used that photo in my online Zoom presentation for the B&ORHS Akron Annual Convention last year.

So though you are suspicious of the provenance of material on Pinterest right now, it may be difficult to identify sources of material found, but I encourage anyone finding material there to examine it closely and compare it with source material you already have for any research you may be doing.
--
Wade Rice


Pinterest and B&O research

Jim Mischke
 


Googling around this evening, I found that most of my B&O image hits were on the web site Pinterest.    

I am a bit suspicious, because I have encountered most of these images before on web sites more closely associated with their originators, although that is debatable as well.  Another topic for another day.

Pinterest cites the web source and one can click on it to go there, yet there is no way all the originators gave any permissions for use on this site.

Is this a seach engine?  Is this a social media site?  Why do they insist I log in for a better experience?  How do they make money?  Ads and user data?

I am only curious now, because Pinterest has come to dominate my B&O google hits, not the host web sites with additional B&O image resources.   Flicker, Akron railroad club, Columbus Railroads, rrpicturearchives.net, Fallen Flags, etc.

Please educate me on the upsides and downsides of this site.










B&O content:

The opening photo is from the University of North Texas, and is miscaptioned as the Capitol Limited in 1959.   Wrong.   This B&O public relations photograph shows the lightweight Columbian, photographed when new in 1949.   Halethorpe is a credible guess at location.   Diesel is EMD F3A #87, built in 1947, and featured in a slew of 1949 B&O PR photos with this train.   B&O F3 A-B combinations probably powered the Columbian in its early years. 

I have emailed the Texas archive involved (not Pinterest) with these corrections, in hopes this will be corrected.   

A nitpicker's work is never done.  And it is harder than it looks.




Re: West Cumbo Yards

Joe Z
 

From some information about the RDG end of the operation, it has been written that the Cumbo Trains were initially to be for five years, in a PRR-B&O effort to starve the Gould WM of coal traffic.  This five year period began a pattern that went on for decades.  


It did not stop with PRR, but continued with PC. The creation of CONRAIL eventually stopped it. 

As recently as 1966, three Cumbo Trains each way used the PRR-RDG route. By 1972, it was down to one daily train.  By 1975 only one 40 car train per month.  

At one time my employer kept records of coal purchases and shipments to their various electric generation stations, to include Bridgeport Harbor in Connecticut I did read some reviews of the shipments came this way and were broken down by lots.   For a utility, one shipment of a coal purchase would involve dozens of trains. The route and participating railroads (or barges/ ships) would be negotiated by a team of people.

I have to guess is the railroads didn’t like this route in later years, but the tariff and agreement still existed.   

This doesn’t answer all your questions, but gives a little more insight.  


Joe Z.  

Buckingham, PA


West Cumbo Yards

Steve Salamon
 

In 1984, I explored the area of West Cumbo Yard complex and took some photos of what remained.  By the time I saw it, the yards were being used for storage of coal loads and surplus equipment.  Of course in its halcyon days it was a major interchange point for coal traffic destined to points on the Reading and the PRR.  The history of why West Cumbo came to be, and its early operations, have been documented in Roberts East End book, and in other places.  But there seems to be little documentation regarding West Cumbo in its later years.  I'm hoping that some in this esteemed group might be able to provide some details.  Some specific questions follow.    

Does anyone know when the interchange traffic with PRR ceased?  I've heard that it was sometime in the 1960's, but don't know if that is correct.  

At the east end of Yard D, there was once a turntable, engine facilities, and a YMCA for train crews.  I've heard these all closed during the 1930's.  Can anyone verify?  

 I've heard that even after interchange traffic ceased, that B&O maintained a yard office at West Cumbo and used some of the yard trackage for sorting of coal loads and empties.  Can anyone verify if that is correct?  Or when the yard office was closed?  

Appears there was a yard office at east end of Yard A, near W Tower.  Is that correct?  

Was there an manual hump between A and B Yards?  It would have been almost directly behind W Tower.  My memory is that it looked like a manual hump, but I'm not sure.  

Was merchandise traffic handled at West Cumbo?  Or was it strictly for coal (and coal empties)?  

I've attached some photos that I took around the West Cumbo area.  All photos from Sept 1, 1984, unless otherwise noted.  

Photo #1 is of Yard B, looking west from Harlan Springs Road overpass.  W Tower would be around the curve to the right.  Appears Yard B was being used to store coal loads at the time.    

Photo #2 is of Yard B looking east from Harlan Springs Road overpass, toward Yard D and the connection to PRR.  Yard D is on the right, with stored cars.    

Photo #3 is looking west at Yard A.  W Tower and the main tracks are to the left.  

Photo #4 is opposite of #3, looking east at Yard B to the left.  Harlan Springs Road overpass would be around the curve to the left.  The track to the right goes to C Yard, along the main tracks east of W Tower.  

Photo #5 is looking west at Yard A.  The track at lower left corner goes to Yard D.  The connection to the main line at left would have allowed trains to move directly between the main and Yard B.  

Photo #6 is looking east on the Low Grade with lead track to Yard A on the left.  The double track main is behind the trees on the right, and W Tower can be seen in the distance.  

Photo #7 is a westbound train passing W Tower, August 19, 1978.  Yard C would be directly behind the train, but hidden by the trees.  

Any information about the above would be most appreciated.  Thanks,

Steve Salamon




Re: How did the railroad name it's trains in the late 50's?

Ken Briers
 

Another way to look at it is that it was the train that took all the lower priority traffic that was not added to the higher priority manifest trains. 

 

A guy told me that about 40 years ago, while I was train watching on the Harpers Ferry platform.  He was a regular there and seemed to know all about the various trains in the daily parade. 

 

Stay Safe!

Ken Briers

(202) 841-6851

 

From: main@BaltimoreAndOhioRailroadList.groups.io <main@BaltimoreAndOhioRailroadList.groups.io> On Behalf Of Wade via groups.io
Sent: Friday, October 22, 2021 10:43 AM
To: main@BaltimoreAndOhioRailroadList.groups.io
Subject: Re: [BaltimoreAndOhioRailroadList] How did the railroad name it's trains in the late 50's?

 

I believe the "Dirty Shirt" long transit time from Cumberland to Brunswick was due to its having to drop off and/or pick up loads/empties from customers along the way, if what I understood from Norm Nelson to be correct.
--
Wade Rice


Re: How did the railroad name it's trains in the late 50's?

Wade
 

I believe the "Dirty Shirt" long transit time from Cumberland to Brunswick was due to its having to drop off and/or pick up loads/empties from customers along the way, if what I understood from Norm Nelson to be correct.
--
Wade Rice


Re: Coal Loads for Athearn Cars

spadstevens@...
 

H. D. Smith, 13630 G. A. R. Hwy., Chardon, OH,  44024.     I caution you, though, this is from a few years ago.  I hope they're still in business.

Carl Stevens


Re: How did the railroad name it's trains in the late 50's?

Jim Mischke
 



I concur.   Once, there is a little Christmas feature in the B&O Magazine, where the Dirtty Shirt crew delivered a Christmas package to a particular youngster enroute.   A trains set, ya think?   Article mentions their normal transit time Cumberland - Brunswick was nine hours, hence the Dirty Shirt.




On Wednesday, October 20, 2021, 09:42:33 AM MDT, John via groups.io <jcurtrig@...> wrote:


There is a copy of the B&O Freight Working Book from 1957 with updates to 1958 on the multimodalways.org website.  See link below to it.  As for the name "Dirty Shirt", my understanding is the nickname came from the amount fo work the train had to do in route.   

http://www.multimodalways.org/docs/railroads/companies/B&O/B&O%20Freight%20Schedule%208-1-1957.pdf


Re: How did the railroad name it's trains in the late 50's?

Robert Federle
 

Here are a few more from some 1982 B&O Train Sheet through Hamilton Ohio:

Eastbound / Southbound

The Buckeye (no reported counterpart)
CO 90
CI 93
Southbound Flyer
Dixie 99
The Southwesterner

Westbound / Northbound

TL 92
CO 93
Midwesterner
CO 91
Northland Flyer
Northeasterner

Robert Federle
Hamilton Ohio


From: main@BaltimoreAndOhioRailroadList.groups.io <main@BaltimoreAndOhioRailroadList.groups.io> on behalf of Fran Giacoma <frangiacoma@...>
Sent: Tuesday, October 19, 2021 7:40 PM
To: main@BaltimoreAndOhioRailroadList.groups.io <main@BaltimoreAndOhioRailroadList.groups.io>
Subject: Re: [BaltimoreAndOhioRailroadList] How did the railroad name it's trains in the late 50's?
 
Ken - there are some B&O names on the attached 1952 AAR list that I found on the Internet.
Fran Giacoma

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